In Conversation with Sean Lim
Having graduated with a BSc in chemistry from the University of Melbourne in 2016, Sean Lim started his career as a scientist at Merck, before undertaking an MSc in chemistry/physics at the National University of Singapore. Today, Sean works as a lab consultant and an associate lecturer of chemistry and pharmaceutical science at La Trobe University's Singapore campus, and has also set up a science communication website, For the Love of Science, which publishes accessible scientific writing. In a recent interview led by Iona Finney, members of the Youth STEM Matters Team were able to speak to Sean and gain some new insights from his experience in science communication, critical thinking and his career into STEM.
Sean Lim
Iona: For anyone unfamiliar, would you be able to tell us a little bit more about your work?
Sean: Mostly my interests lie in chemistry and pharmaceutical science, so my career is in those areas. I started working as a chemist at Merck in 2017, which was my first job, and then I moved into consulting, mainly because I really enjoyed the aspect of helping people learn and understand. In my role as a consultant, I help labs solve their technical problems to do with their experiment design, or their lab equipment and any issues or recommendations they need within the pharmaceutical manufacturing space. I also teach chemistry and pharmaceutical science at a local university. So basically it's just helping people - I enjoy teaching, and education is a passion of mine, so I am fortunate that in my career, I'm able to help people, by using my technical knowledge and my problem solving skills to help people improve their workflows, and then in the lab, or in the case of my teaching role, helping them in a more direct way - helping them learn, breaking down complex topics in science and helping them understand it.
Iona: Amazing. So, how did working in the labs prepare you for a career in consulting? What practices from the lab do you still use in your current job?
Sean: It's quite different because when I was a chemist at work, I used to do a lot of lab, chemistry stuff, causing fires and explosions and things like that. Moving away from the bench work, there are some skills that I've taken along with me, and one of them would definitely be time management. The ability to prioritise is really important, so it's definitely worth investing your time to plan how you spend the rest of your time, based on the impact of the outcome or of the projected impact. So from a business sense, this impact would be like the cost of the business or the cost you save, or how much money you earn. Then in terms of science communication, this impact would be how many people you reach or the benefit that you'll be able to provide to people. The sooner you learn how to prioritise based on this, the more productive you become, so I think that's a key skill that everyone should learn.
Iona: Yes, that's really interesting, thank you. Which area of chemistry or pharmacology fascinates you the most? And why?
Sean: It's broad in terms of my writing and my science communication, but in terms of umbrella interests or categories that these sub-interests fall into, I would say, education, of course, is one of them. And the other one would be drug development. I think modern medicine is incredible, because if you think about it, the human body is made up of around 37 trillion cells. 37 trillion is a huge number, and when we take medicine, we rely on this little chemical to benefit a subset of those cells in a way that helps us live healthier, longer lives. I think modern medicine is a miracle, so that's why I try to write in those areas.
Iona: What have been some of your favourite science communication articles? You mentioned that you focus more on education and drug development, so perhaps topics that you've brought to light that you maybe hadn't considered before, or ones that have had a positive outcome?
Sean: There's so many! The thing is, I don't think my science writing is fantastic - there's a lot of people out there who can write much better than me, so I actually like to read other people's writings more than I read my own. I really enjoy science communication articles that go against the grain of conventional thinking, as it's just really interesting to view other people's perspectives. There was this one article I read a couple of weeks back, which was written by William Shatner, the actor who played Captain James Kirk in Star Trek. He went to space last year on Blue Origin, and he wrote about it a few weeks ago…He mentioned, obviously, this excitement before going up to space, but once in space, he experienced this grief or sadness. And he mentioned that the real beauty isn't up there in space, but actually down here on Earth. That really resonated with me, because it reminds us that we need to protect and cherish the only Earth we have, because there is no one out there who can save us from ourselves.
Iona: That’s so interesting, thank you for that. A lot of the articles that you've posted on For the Love of Science are about recent developments in science. Which of these is the most exciting to you and why?
Sean: So my current interest in my woodpecker brain is sustainability, especially food tech. I'm not sure if this is still the case, but the last time I checked, cultured meat, or lab grown meat is only available for sale in Singapore where I live. So there's a lot of challenges that come with bringing this kind of food technology to the public. You have the cost, scale of challenges, as well as the public perception of this. A lot of the public think meat grown in a lab is unsafe or dangerous, so that's the area that I'm focusing my writing on.
I also have an article that will be published soon about the Alaskan snow crabs. I don't know if you know this, but the Alaskan crab season has been cancelled for 2022. If you've watched Deadliest Catch on the Discovery Channel, this is the same season that's been cancelled, so there's no Deadliest Catch for 2022 because Alaska has cancelled this snow crab season. A lot of news articles have been covering this, raising awareness about the dwindling populations of snow crabs, but they don't really mention why, so I did a bit of research on it and I found some really exciting facts.
Iona: Actually, a member of our team, I think also from Singapore, wrote an article on lab grown meats in our first Print Edition! With our next questions, we’d love to focus a bit more on the For the Love of Science and setting that up. What inspired you to set it up after previous careers in STEM?
Sean: It was kind of a haphazard process, to be honest. I enjoy reading, writing and science, so, out of college in 2017, I had some time on my hands, so I decided to set up a website where I would write about science. I wasn't particularly good at it, but I just kept on publishing, and I've been doing it ever since, and people have been coming to read my articles.
Iona: It's really great to hear that you decided to set it up and it's now grown so much - it's really inspiring. So you mentioned on the For The Love of Science website, that popular science articles break down some more complex topics, so they're more understandable to non-scientists. What impact do you think lack of accessibility in science communication has, and how can it be improved?
“Accessibility and inclusion in science, like in all areas of life, is so important”
Sean: So accessibility and inclusion in science, like in all areas of life, is so important. In science, specifically, you have a lot of jargon and complexity surrounding new discoveries, and this can deter the public from learning, which is kind of surprising, because all around us, we have inventions and discoveries that are basically built on this progress in science - all this technology we have around us. So we have this problem - it's a disconnect between science and the public. Some of the public thinks that science is the realm of scientists: ‘so who cares? You don't need to know about science, because we just leave it to the scientists’. So, this is an issue that For The Love of Science is trying to fix - to act as a bridge - and basically everyone who practises science communication is trying to bridge that gap between science and the public.
Iona: I think that it's really important that non-scientists are able to access those recent discoveries too. So you also described on your website that it was a place to publish articles that gave an insight into the beauty of our natural world. So could you tell us a bit more about that? And what kind of topics do you think demonstrate that beauty?
Sean: It's tough, because if we want to get people interested in science, we can’t just throw them a science concept, like ‘this is an acid, this is a base, learn about it’. A lot of the time it takes some easing them into the process. And I think that the natural world, or the phenomena that we encounter in the natural world, is a good way to do that. So for example, I wrote an article a few years back about why the colour blue is so rare in nature. So, if you think about wildlife, like, plants and animals come in a whole range of beautiful colours. But blue is especially rare in nature. No one actually knows the reason for this, but there are some theories. Blue as a colour is higher in energy in terms of the visible spectrum, it's higher in energy than your yellows and reds, so there's physics to be learned in that area. We can say because blue is higher in energy, that the animals and plants might have evolved away from this to conserve energy, and so you can teach about evolution and natural selection. I think it's just about looking for areas that people can relate to, and then expanding on them through your scientific perspective.
Iona: We’d really like to ask you some more about science communication, as it’s also a key part of Youth STEM Matters. You mentioned that when you started For the Love of Science, that you didn't know what science communication was, and you hadn’t done much of it before. So what have you learned while setting up For the Love of Science, and how can others also be informed on the importance of science communication?
Sean: As you mentioned, I didn't really know what I was doing until I started doing it, so I had no idea what science communication was, even while I was doing it. But, I learned that setting up a website is surprisingly easy, and there's a lot of resources online that you can look at to learn how to set up a website. The hard part is actually getting people to come to your website. Especially with science topics, there's not many people who are looking specifically for science topics when they go on the internet, and so one of the things I learned was how to drive traffic through science writing, by creating value for your readers.
Iona: I think, as you mentioned, other people have different interests in science, and it's difficult to put a value on it. That sounds like something that might be really important in getting people to read these articles. How do you communicate science when the scientific community isn't in agreement? Does the uncertainty hinder the message?
Sean: Scientists are always in disagreement, to be fair. The interesting thing about science is that you can never prove something to be true, but you can disprove theories through experiment design, and so, of course, there's theories that are generally accepted. You have gravity and Einstein's relativity, quantum mechanics; these are theories that most, 99.9%, of scientists agree upon, whereas others are more in dispute. For example, in health or alternative medicines, you have groups that are keen to disprove the science that has been done. Or, you might have issues where the evidence hasn't been gathered yet. As science communicators, we're responsible for providing an objective view where we mention all the points, but we're also free to give our own opinion based on the scientific data. I think that's one of the advantages of science communication - that we can have our own opinions - whereas in a journal article that scientists publish it has to be all objective. Everyone's opinion is valuable, especially if it comes from an area backed by scientific evidence, so that's one cool area that we can emphasise on.
Iona: Have you had the opportunity to travel? You mentioned that you studied at the University of Melbourne, and the National University of Singapore, so have you noticed a difference in the level of science communication in different places, and the effect that this has had on society?
Sean: This is a tough one, because I haven't actually noticed firsthand the effects of science communication in different countries, so I haven't noticed the correlation between how science is perceived by society versus the level of science communication that happens in each country. But I looked at this question beforehand, and then I looked at FTLOScience and our website metrics, as we do track where our readers come from. Of course, countries where English is the native language are ranked in the top few because we publish in English. And then we have countries where English isn't the native language, but we still receive a lot of traffic from, such as India, countries in Southeast Asia, as well as Europe. We do notice that there are a lot of underserved countries in the second group, especially in South America, Africa and some countries in the Middle East. So even though English isn't the native language for a lot of these countries, this lack of traffic to our website, if we can use our website as a metric, shows that there is a disparity in the accessibility of science in different countries, which is definitely a challenge that we have to overcome in the coming years.
Iona: It was great to hear about that real-life data from your website, so thank you for looking at that! What impact do you think misinformation in the public has on science communication? And could science communication actually have a role in helping to solve it?
Sean: Misinformation is huge; there's a whole industry that profits off misinformation - people and organisations. They abuse their positions of authority to spread misinformation and profit off of it in some way or another. A lot of this is, in science especially, because the public can view science as a mystery, a black box, I guess, where money goes in one side, and then products go out the other. So science communication kind of opens this black box of research, and gives people the tools that we need to combat misinformation: knowledge.
Iona: Yes, and back to when you mentioned about making it more accessible, I think that really links in - making sure that people have a general understanding so that they can help combat misinformation themselves. And so in certain degrees, science communication aspects are being introduced, so what impact do you think they will have on the future of research and science communication, and should science communication be taught more?
Sean: Yes, it's definitely a growing field. My younger sister actually studied for a degree in science communication, and she now works at a science PR firm, so she handles press releases and press conferences for science companies. I think the commercial side of research is starting to understand the importance of science communication. Institutions and universities offer degrees in science communication, and they even have specialised science communication roles that help the scientists showcase their research, because in the end, funding comes from the public (many research grants come from money from taxpayers), who mostly are not scientists. If you're a private company, then your money usually comes from private investors, and they probably won't have the scientific background or knowledge of what you're doing in terms of your scientific research. It definitely needs to be taught more, because science communication doesn't necessarily come naturally to scientists, so we need specialised science communicators who can do the job.
Iona: I agree, it is really important as well. So the following questions will focus a bit more on encouraging others to get involved with science communication. What impact do you think science communication can have in tackling global challenges? How do you think young people can be encouraged to get involved with this and perhaps write articles about global challenges that they themselves are interested in?
“Scientists are just kids who never stopped questioning, and who have learned how to ask the right questions.”
Sean: Keeping science accessible is definitely the main pillar of this. I always say that children make the best scientists. In family gatherings, sometimes I'd rather talk to the kids than to the adults, because they provide more thought provoking conversation. Scientists are just kids who never stopped questioning, and who have learned how to ask the right questions. If we can show the next generation - your generation and beyond - that science is accessible, and that anyone can improve the world we live in, through science and science communication, then I think the world would be a better place.
Iona: Yeah, that is really inspiring, thank you. And so what tips would you have for anyone who would like to start writing science communication articles?
Sean: I would say, just do it; pick your favourite field, and just write about it. By doing it, you'll be better. You don't have to publish it if you feel like you're not confident in your writing - or communicating science by recording a video, giving talks, etc. - as long as you're doing something, you'll just get better at it. The thing is, with science, that there is so much amazing research being done. It gets published in journals, but the public rarely reads it, which is a shame because scientists spend their whole lives doing research, and if no one knows about it, then it's a kind of a pity.
On the internet, a lot of hobbies suffer from not having enough content, like when I was reading about gardening, after a few weeks I realised everyone's just repeating the same thing and I've already learned everything that I need to know about gardening. Science isn't like this, because there's always new science being researched and being published. But there's not enough science communication content being made about it. So there is just so much more, there's so much more people can do to communicate science, and I am really excited about the future of it.
Iona: Yeah, and I think your advice of just giving it a go and just keep on practising is really important for young people and people who want to start writing. And so more specifically - you sort of touched upon it in the previous answer - what advice would you give to young people who want to start writing science communication articles, especially if it's not something that they've thought about or done before?
“You don’t need to be a renowned scientist or an expert to communicate science.”
Sean: You don't need to be a renowned scientist or an expert to communicate science. I think that's the one piece of advice I would give to young people who might not have the expertise. In setting up FTLOScience, I was kind of lucky in that I started doing science communication before I knew what it was, because if I had known that there were people publishing similar articles, that were like a million times better than mine, I probably would have given up, but I'm glad I didn't because sharing science with the world is so fulfilling. And you know, if you keep doing something, you're bound to improve. For me, I started off without any talent or without a clue what I was doing, so I think that's something that you have to keep in mind: you don't need to be an expert in the field as long as you can communicate it effectively.
Iona: That is brilliant, thank you so much! And so I'm now just going to open the floor to any other questions that Mhairi or Rutendo might have, so that you can answer them too.
Mhairi McCann: It can be in For The Love of Science or outwith it, but what have the biggest challenges been?
Sean: In For The Love Of Science, for the first three years or so I was basically writing what I enjoyed. I was writing about my interests, rather than what would benefit the readers in terms of what information they would gain that would be valuable. And, because of that, initially, the traffic to the website wasn't great as search engines weren’t picking up on it, so it wasn't getting much coverage. Even though we were doing well on social media channels, the website itself wasn't getting much traffic. So I did a lot of research on how to write effectively, in a way that would drive traffic. Over the next couple of years I tried to incorporate that into science writing specifically and I found out that it worked - people search about topics that they need answers to, whether it's out of interest, or a research project, or just for homework, so we can tailor our writing to this. Search engines want their users to get the information they need, so by keeping this in mind, you can write articles that show Google, or whatever search engine, that our content can provide this relevant information. And then, we can use that traffic to drive whatever mission we want to share with the reader from there.
Iona: Linking back to encouraging young people to get involved with writing science communication articles, is there a way for them to get involved with For the Love of Science?
Sean: For the Love of Science has a ‘write for us’ programme, and I think it's great for people who are just starting out in science communication. People who want to write something, such as a science topic they're interested in, can pitch the idea to us. We're quite picky about who we choose to work with, because we do spend a lot of time reading the work and giving feedback on how to improve that person’s science writing. We show you what works and what doesn't, and then we publish the finished article on our website. Our authors get credited in their author bio with links to your social media, your blog, or your website. I think it's such a great way to get your science writing out there.
Iona: Thank you so much for giving up your time and joining us today Sean - it has been amazing!
Hello 2023 Youth STEM Matters Research Conference Attendee! The phrase you need for your quest is: future!
